Page 1 of 2

Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Sun May 17, 2020 7:14 am
by balzaccom

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Sun May 17, 2020 10:04 am
by Wandering Daisy
Seems like we all gloat over reduced energy consumption if it does not impact our life style. Not sure everyone who is gloating about the demise of coal, however good that would be for the air quality, is similarly ready to ditch flying , over-driving or giving up their recreational world travel. We Americans still have an overly large per-capita environmental footprint. Clean air will only happen if we rethink our entire life style.

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Sun May 17, 2020 10:12 am
by rlown
My next vehicle will be a 2015 Volkswagen TDI Sportwagen.
Nothing wrong with coal, as the scrubber technology constantly improves.

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Sun May 17, 2020 10:21 am
by Wandering Daisy
Scrubbers or no, the coal industry has been in demise for decades due to the economics, not environmental concerns. Coal is not easy or cheap to transport long distances. My brother worked in a coal power plant in Utah, and they saw what was coming, and converted to burn natural gas. It just made more economic sense.

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Sun May 17, 2020 11:59 am
by c9h13no3
I can't figure out how a cruise line or airline hasn't gone out of business yet. I suppose everyone gets a bailout, but coal won't due to politics?

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Sun May 17, 2020 5:56 pm
by balzaccom
Coal won't because even with a bailout it can't compete economically with natural gas...

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Mon May 18, 2020 5:11 am
by The Other Tom
rlown wrote:
Sun May 17, 2020 10:12 am
My next vehicle will be a 2015 Volkswagen TDI Sportwagen.
Nothing wrong with coal, as the scrubber technology constantly improves.
I don't know what your window for a new to you vehicle is, but have you considered an electric vehicle?

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Mon May 18, 2020 8:03 am
by Wandering Daisy
If one were to leave an electric vehicle at a trailhead for a week, would it still start when you returned? What about 2 weeks or more? I always thought electric vehicles were primarily for urban areas.

Electric vehicles have their own environmental issues, such as manufacturing of batteries (and disposal). If your local electricity is generated by coal, your plug-in vehicle is still contributing to such pollution.

The better answer to me is simply to drive less. I have been amazed that I still have half a tank of gas with last fill-up late March. Given total gas used annually, I find it is not the long drives to trailheads that use most gas, but all those everyday little trips in town, particularly commuting to work before I retired.

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Mon May 18, 2020 8:29 am
by RSC
Wandering Daisy wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 8:03 am
If one were to leave an electric vehicle at a trailhead for a week, would it still start when you returned? What about 2 weeks or more? I always thought electric vehicles were primarily for urban areas.
One week, two weeks, sure. More than a month, maybe you would want to disconnect the 12 volt battery. I live in a somewhat rural county and use my Spark EV around town -- getting groceries and such. Convenient to fuel up at home -- my solar panels generate about 7 MWh per year, I use about 4 MWh including the car, and export about 3 MWh to the grid.

Being married, we kind of like to have two cars, and for trips to trailheads, we use our Toyota Highlander. Gas hog, but it has ground clearance, AWD drive, and room for two to sleep in back. Still waiting for these features in an electric vehicle, but I'm sure they're coming.

Re: Can't help thinking this is good news...

Posted: Mon May 18, 2020 8:33 am
by c9h13no3
Wandering Daisy wrote:
Mon May 18, 2020 8:03 am
If your local electricity is generated by coal, your plug-in vehicle is still contributing to such pollution.
They're quite a bit more efficient though. Most car manufacturers have stripped EV's down as light as possible in order to boost up the range, so even if it was a gas car, it'd get great fuel efficiency. Add that to the fact that in most states, renewables (like hydroelectric) contribute significantly to the fraction of energy produced, and the environmental comparison is not particularly close.

I'm totally a convert. At this point, with the government continuing to throw free money at you for buying an EV, if you're a two car household in California, I think one of your cars should be an EV. They're just too convenient. Even setting aside the environmental benefits, I have a gas station at my house and it's super fun to drive.